Legal Interpretations
Sun 2011
Summary
The Question
Can a commercial helicopter applicant fly the night cross-country required by 14 CFR 61.129 under IFR and count it toward the instrument time requirement?
Background
A requester described a commercial helicopter pilot applicant wanting a 2-hour night cross-country under IFR to satisfy 14 CFR 61.129(c)(3)(iii) and also count toward the 5 hours of instrument flight under 14 CFR 61.129(c)(3)(i).
The FAA’s Interpretation
Apparently yes; the FAA answered by explaining that the August 2009 final rule removed the VFR requirement from the cross-country provisions of 14 CFR 61.129(c)(3)(ii) and (iii), so required cross-country training flights may be flown under VFR or IFR. The rule's preamble leaves that choice to the applicant's needs and the instructor's discretion.
- Requester
- Sun
- Issued
- August 11, 2011
- Subjects
- Pilot Certification & Privileges · General Operating & Flight Rules · Training Schools & Centers
Regulations Cited
Page 1
U.S. Department
of Transportation
Federal Aviation
Administration
August 11, 2011
Mr. Mike Sun
Dear Mr. Sun:
Office of the Chief Counsel 800 Independence Ave., S.W .
Washington, 0.C. 20591
This is in response to your letter seeking clarification of 14 C.F.R. §61.129-Aeronautical Experience, in particular whether a student pilot training for a commercial pilot certificate can combine a night cross country flight with instrument training. In your letter you presented the facts as follows; a student training for a commercial helicopter pilot certificate wants to conduct a 2 hour night cross country flight under IFR rules and use the time to satisfy the night cross country flight requirement under §61.129(c)(3)(iii) and, in part, the 5 hours of flight solely by reference to instruments requirement under §61.129(c)(3)(i). In other words, the person receiving training wants to have the 2 hours of night cross country flight time also count as 2 hours of instrument flight time.
Prior to the publication of the August 21, 2009 final rule amending Parts 61, 91, and 141 (74 Fed. Reg. 161, p. 42499), cross-country flights, both day and night under §61.129(c)(3)(ii) and (iii), had to be done under VFR rules. However, the August 2009 final rule removed the reference to VFR in §61.129(c)(3)(ii) and (iii), as well as other sections of §61.129. The preamble to the August 2009 final rule (74 Fed. Reg. 161, p. 42532) explains that the final rule revises §61.129, "to allow the required cross country training flights for commercial pilot certification to be performed under VFR or IFR." The preamble to the final rule goes on to say that, despite the removal of the requirement for day and night cross country flights to be performed under VFR, "the determination of whether the cross country training is performed under VFR or IFR is best left to the needs of the applicant and the instructor's discretion."
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We hope that this response has been helpful. Please do not hesitate to contact my staff at (202) 267-3073 if you have additional questions. This response has been prepared by Neal O'Hara, an Attorney in the Regulations Division, Office of the Chief Counsel, and was coordinated with the General Aviation and Commercial Division of the Flight Standards Service.
Sincerely,
/~~¥~Rebecca B. M'acPherson
Assistant Chief Counsel for Regulations
Regulations Referenced
Snapshot retrieved August 6, 2026.